Comments on: Your Pod Coffee Tastes Bad

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Thu, 26 Jan 2012 23:46:00 +0000

Disposable crap that will solve all your problems?!? Where have (n’t) I heard that before?!? And isn’t that the kind of mentality that got us where we are now?!? Just that much more to add to a landfill, saves no extra time in the brewing process and cost that much more time after time after time . . .

No offense meant, but seriously!

Get a Hario V60 02 ceramic coffee dripper, a 100 pack of white filters and adjust your grind so the whole process from start to finish takes about 3 minutes (fine tune to personal taste). Done right this is the cleanest, most flavorful cup of coffee there is. And it takes 30 seconds to wash and dry it. The less disposable crap we buy the more money we end up saving and the better our environment will be.

Good luck with your roasting business Reg and open an account with Hario/Sungarden Tea and sell the V60 instead!!!

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Wed, 25 Jan 2012 07:40:00 +0000

Watch out when buying green beans from local shops/roasters! You will often pay as much or more just for the green beans as you will lose at least 20% of the weight when you roast. A good rule of thumb is paying less than half of what the shop/roaster sells the same beans roasted for, I.E. if he’s selling roasted Ethiopian Sidamo for $15/lb he shouldn’t be selling them for more than $7/lb, or at least YOU shouldn’t be buying them for . . .
That’s actually why Tom (the owner of Sweet Maria’s) started his business and it is an AWESOME source of green beans for home roasters!

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Wed, 25 Jan 2012 07:24:00 +0000

The Norwegians as a whole like their coffee stronger than any other area surveyed. For what it’s worth:
Norwegians like coffee that has 1.3 – 1.5% total dissolved solids
Europeans like coffee that has 1.25 – 1.45% total dissolved solids
Americans like coffee that has 1.15 – 1.35% total dissolved solids
But everyone agrees that 18 – 22% of flavor extracted is optimal

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Wed, 25 Jan 2012 07:18:00 +0000

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Yes on #1 and I have a coffee consulting business as far as #2 so this is actually my job (which could make #1 irrelevant but it’s still funny as hell!!!)

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Wed, 25 Jan 2012 07:13:00 +0000

Pods will contain the CO2 within the capsule but they won’t keep the CO2 in the grounds (which applies to beans in vacuum sealed bags for that matter too). Once the pod is opened you will be able to smell the flavor that has left the grounds but it won’t be contained IN the grounds anymore for you to enjoy as you drink your brewed cup.
Nitrogen flushing keeps the coffee free of oxygen, which oxidizes the coffee, giving it a rancid, stale flavor. What it won’t do is hold the CO2 IN the coffee.
Technically as CO2 leaves the coffee (grounds or beans) it is basically pushing the flavor/aromatics out, the oils being some of that flavor, but only part of it.
Sorry to confuse with the time scenario. Ground coffee that is 15 minutes old has lost the same amount of CO2 as 16 day old beans have lost. Ground coffee that is 2 days old is equivalent to 1 month old beans.
I definitely couldn’t say if you could taste the difference between freshly ground coffee and coffee ground the night before, some of it depends on the level of roast you prefer/brew. The lighter the roast the more prevalent the difference is. A lot depends on whether you put anything in your coffee as well. ANY additives will hide the subtle flavors (terroir) of the origin. I’d recommend experimenting yourself, seeing what you notice and adjusting your grinding time accordingly.
If you’re drinking flavored coffee everything I’ve stated is meaningless. You will not taste the terroir of any coffee through the flavoring. If that is the case pods are the best way to go, as the nitrogen flushing will keep the coffee from going stale and you will have the basic coffee flavor along with whatever flavored coffee you purchase.
The most important thing is that you are satisfied with and enjoying your coffee. The more refined your palate becomes the less appealing the majority of coffee available will become.
Hope that helps and sorry to take so long to reply.

By: Reggie

Reggie — Mon, 16 Jan 2012 16:03:00 +0000

I micro roast coffee @ farmer’s markets and for small convenience stores; we’re hoping this will catch on! I have a single cup disposable filter that will solve all your problems! I also carry a container that flushes air out, but has a valve to allow the beans inside to “breathe” you will have to “like” me on FB or twitter to see these two devices: “2coffeeguys”. Reg

By: Reggie

Reggie — Mon, 16 Jan 2012 16:01:00 +0000

By: Reggie

Reggie — Mon, 16 Jan 2012 16:01:00 +0000

By: just curious

just curious — Sun, 15 Jan 2012 07:10:00 +0000

True, most Americans likely have not had coffee brewed to the 1:16.4 ratio. I’m curious, though: what nationality has?

By: Ngaimoko

Ngaimoko — Sun, 15 Jan 2012 02:05:00 +0000

Coffee Scientist, I’m confused. You claim that flavor is lost when CO2 is lost. Chris claims flavor is lost when oils are evaporated. Which is it? And either way, couldn’t a pod (at least potentially, even if not currently done) contain both the CO2 and the oils? With Keurig, is the problem that the nitrogen flushes out the CO2 and/or oils?

Also, you say once that ground coffee loses its flavor in 2 days and now again 15 minutes. Which is it? (I ask because I’m wondering if I’ll *really* be able to tell the difference between coffee ground immediately before brewing vs. the night before.) I do roast, grind, & drip brew my own coffee, so I do appreciate the difference fresh coffee makes, but wondering if my untrained palate can really distinguish all these things the experts are talking about.

Thanks!

By: Our Red House

Our Red House — Fri, 13 Jan 2012 01:41:00 +0000

We use one of those little metal Italian stove top espresso pots with coffee we grind ourselves. The coffee only takes a few minutes to prepare and is fantastic. We’ve often thought about buying a coffee machine but in the end we agree that they cost an awful lot and the only difference would be that we could have milk foam.

By: Gary Ruplinger

Gary Ruplinger — Thu, 12 Jan 2012 18:55:00 +0000

I used to love that my drip coffee maker had a timer on it so that I could put coffee grounds in it the night before and wake up with coffee ready… but then I started to develop an appreciation for coffee itself instead of using it solely as a way to efficiently get caffeine in me. Now I take the time to use a french press every morning, grinding the beans less than 60 seconds before they get the hot water poured over them. A lot more work? Yes! Worth it? Absolutely!

By: Blah

Blah — Wed, 11 Jan 2012 20:27:00 +0000

1:16.4 ratio? Wow, wild guess you are single and have plenty of time on your hands.

By: Kienan

Kienan — Wed, 11 Jan 2012 11:28:00 +0000

Ill admit K-Cups aren’t the worst thing in the world, they make decent coffee. If I had never been exposed to great coffee I might up my impression of K-Cups to very good. Though when you have a fresh roasted, fresh ground & freshly brewed cup of Ethiopian Harrar. Where the flavor of cherries and dark chocolate and so many flavor notes it will take too long to describe. You will never look at any of the pod, pad or whatever types as being any more than hotel room acceptable coffee again.

By: Coffee love

Coffee love — Wed, 11 Jan 2012 10:37:00 +0000

I can’t stand those pods & the only way I’d be tempted to have one is if George Clooney was holding it like in the ad

By: Sedona Sam

Sedona Sam — Wed, 11 Jan 2012 03:51:00 +0000

Hey, you should roast your own coffee too. Not difficult, and small batches will be used well before 3 weeks pass. It takes some attention, but it isn’t brain surgery. You can use a blower-type popcorn popper.

But the best part of roasting your own is that you can get varietal coffees, fair traded, from specific plots – high in Central American mountains, an Indonesian island, or Africa or the Middle East – for less than “who knows what” blends from the grocery. Better coffee for less money – what’s the problem? Check out Sweet Marias online, although any decent sized city will have roasters who will sell you green coffee.

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:43:00 +0000

oxidation and flavor loss are actually two separate entities. Vacuum sealing stops oxidation, not flavor loss. Time is where flavor loss comes in. Freshly ground coffee loses the flavor of 16 day old coffee beans in about 15 minutes, as Chris accurately states. Vacuum sealing, nitrogen flushing or not, will not stop this. When you open a K-Cup the flavor is in the contained gasses, NOT the grounds and it certainly will not be in your cup.

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:19:00 +0000

The Keurig makes average coffee consistently. Vacuum sealed, nitrogen flushed or not, keeps the coffee from going stale. A K-Cup may not be stale but it is dead coffee with
no real flavor profile. It tastes like bland boring coffee, no real
flavor profile that truly fresh well roasted coffee contains. It is NOT fresh. Coffee beans lose the CO2 that holds the flavors inherent in
the bean that any quality roaster is attempting to bring out in the
roasting process in about 3 weeks. Ground coffee loses that same flavor
profile in 2 DAYS, regardless of vacuum sealing, nitrogen flushing or
not. Manually brewed and truly freshly roasted coffee, when done correctly, will far surpass ALL other brewing machines.

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Tue, 10 Jan 2012 07:07:00 +0000

drip coffee is only watered down if there is not enough coffee for the amount of water used. Most people, and shops for that matter, don’t use the right ratio. The only reason pods taste better to you is that it has a better coffee/water ratio. If you had a correctly brewed manual drip cup of coffee you would see coffee in a completely different light. I recommend staying ignorant so you can enjoy what you use.

By: theCoffeeScientist

theCoffeeScientist — Tue, 10 Jan 2012 06:56:00 +0000

No, pods are NOT fresh. They may not be stale as stated in the article above, but they are NOT fresh. Coffee beans lose the CO2 that holds the flavors inherent in the bean that any quality roaster is attempting to bring out in the roasting process in about 3 weeks. Ground coffee loses that same flavor profile in 2 DAYS, regardless of vacuum sealing, nitrogen flushing or not. What vacuum sealing does is keep oxygen out which is what makes coffee taste stale and rank. Pod coffee may not be stale but it is dead coffee with no real flavor profile. It tastes like bland boring coffee, no real flavor profile that truly fresh well roasted coffee contains. Manual brewing is the best way if you’re not lazy, truly love coffee and aren’t using it to primarily get a caffeine boost. Unfortunately it takes knowledge that few offer. First off, you need to weigh the coffee you’re going to brew on a scale (dose weight). Secondly, you need to pour the water in the manual brewer on a tared out scale so you add a PRECISE amount of water (brew water weight). The ratio of coffee to water should between 1:16.4 and 1:17. That’s 1 gram of coffee to 16.4 – 17 grams of water. if you’re using a pourover (not the Clever though, plastic is BAD! Ok, that’s personal, but I recommend using glass, ceramic or stainless) your grind should be fine enough that it takes about 3 minutes from start of pour to the finished brew. If it takes more than 4 minutes you’re getting close to overextracting your coffee, leading to bitter, astringent coffee. French press is trickier as YOU have to decide when to end the brewing, but you need to dump the brewed coffee out of the press or it will keep extracting.

Most Americans honestly haven’t had well brewed coffee. There is a science to it that few are interested in taking the time to learn. Anyone really interested should read Scott Rao’s ‘Everything But Espresso’ and/or Ted Lingle’s ‘The Basics of Brewing Coffee”. A 1:17 coffee/water ratio is the most important place to start. The next step is throwing away the blade grinder, getting a REAL coffee grinder (like a Baratza Maestro or better) and grinding right before you brew your coffee.

I could keep blathering on, but the most important thing with coffee is ‘If you like it who cares what anyone else says”. It’s personal taste.

By: Pauline Harris34

Pauline Harris34 — Mon, 09 Jan 2012 07:50:00 +0000

Rubbish. My Nespresso machine produces excellent espressos. The large and constantly changing range of coffees keeps it interesting. And surely the fact that the coffee is sealed in little aluminium pods keeps it fresh?!

By: Marquus

Marquus — Mon, 09 Jan 2012 05:01:00 +0000

The convenience isn’t only in the morning cook, but the purchasing and disposal as well. Your “oh by the way”, you have to buy beans recently roasted if you can find them and then grind them and maintain the grinder makes the very simple solution of squirting coffee through a syringe a big deal actually.

By: swagv

swagv — Sun, 08 Jan 2012 02:20:00 +0000

Pod machines have always been one step forward in convenience and two steps back in quality. They’re akin to 128k mp3s versus CDs. The other irony is that if you had to design a coffee system that maximizes the amount of additional materials extraction, processing, transportation, and waste with every cup served, you’d come up with a pod machine.

By: Carl Barrett Jr.

Carl Barrett Jr. — Sun, 08 Jan 2012 00:24:00 +0000

It has already been said over and over, but I still have to say it. Don’t down talk a Keurig if you’ve never tried one. Do you really think they could sell a $200 coffee maker that made bad coffee? Pods are sealed in little paper nuggets, they definitely go stale. K-Cups are vacuum sealed w/ nitrogen. They will keep for weeks and months. I’ve drank French Pressed coffee as well as many high dollar brewers and coffee types. My Keurig stacks up against it all!

By: Maria Fe Camaya O'Neill

Maria Fe Camaya O'Neill — Sun, 08 Jan 2012 00:00:00 +0000

I love my Keurig. It may not be the absolute best coffee there is but it sure is a huge step up from the drip style coffee makers i used to use. Someone else was saying that the k-cups are sealed right after the beans have been ground and the use of Nitrogen helps preserve the freshness. That makes sense because every k-cup i’ve ever used is packed air tight and tastes quite fresh. I wouldn’t say that they sit that long on the shelf either, at least my grocerie store can’t keep them in supply and i find myself having to ocasionally order my favourite flavour online. Mmmmm…french roast, bold. I think i’ll have one now!

By: VitaminCM

VitaminCM — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 22:51:00 +0000

Those pods taste like a Dow Chemical factory’s butt hole.

By: First Name

First Name — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 22:09:00 +0000

I learned to love coffee with a $30 automatic coffee pot.
I like my parents’ $80 K-cup machine.
I love my sister’s $380 automatic espresso machine.
I will forever miss the fully-manual $2500 near-professional grade espresso machine that I used 3+ times daily when I worked for my school’s CS department.
In my experience with coffee appliances you get what you pay for.

But as for this french press thing, how much hassle is it to clean up and make a second batch? I for one would really hate to spend 10+ minutes making a mug of coffee for myself and my sister every morning.

By: Lists

Lists — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 22:03:00 +0000

Drip coffee tastes like crap, the pods DO taste better but you should have them as espressos. Drip stuff is so watered down it doesn’t matter about the beans.

An espresso machine is better than Nespresso but you can keep your drips and presses.

By: Joe

Joe — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 21:41:00 +0000

Who drinks one cup? Give me a giant travel mug and a thermos, and I’m good till noon ;]

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 21:28:00 +0000

Tell me about it… I was making $5 coffee when I should have been staring 100 startups. Financially ruined by age 20 and no fun orgy/drug orgy stories. Shoulda woulda coulda..

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 20:19:00 +0000

illy is mighty tasty but so expensive…

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 20:16:00 +0000

granted my coffee is a little stale still, as I grind a week’s worth at home and bring it to work. but it and the french press I keep at work still makes coffee that tastes 100 times better than the pods everyone else uses and tried to convince me to join them in buying. And their pods are really not any more convenient than my french press considering they have to wait while fighting over who uses the machine first, and 75% of the time the machine decides not to work anyway.

even if the machine worked all the time and was always available, the coffee it makes just tastes watery. I can’t stand it. and k-cups creep me out. the machine is pouring boiling water into a plastic cup, leeching out all the toxic chemicals in the cup into your coffee. The only ones in the building who seems to agree with me though are the guy from Italy and the guy from Serbia. The Italian guy got his own french press when he saw mine, and the Serbian guy just complains every day that we don’t have a professional espresso machine.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 19:54:00 +0000

Some coffee drinkers are elitists.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 19:34:00 +0000

aren’t the pods air tight, which would make your all-important oils stay inside ? nice rant though.

By: Danielowenuk

Danielowenuk — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 19:02:00 +0000

Iberital mc2 + gaggia classic + sigri beans. You can keep all you nespresso jazz

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 18:50:00 +0000

Then they sit on the shelf for a year and go stale.

I think his reaction is to pod-snobs who think their coffee is great when its really just OK. I’ll drink truckstop coffee burnt black though. As a former batista I have the cred to be a snob, but in the end I just want my fix.

Edit, batitsta, LOL. I’ll leave it.

WHO ARE YOU?!? I’M BATISTA

By: Chris Davies

Chris Davies — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 18:46:00 +0000

And yet I – and others – still find the taste underwhelms in comparison to a few minutes work with a Clever Coffee Dripper. If you’ve found a pod coffee that you enjoy, great, but I can’t agree with you :)

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 18:42:00 +0000

I used to own an illy brand coffee shop: no bullshit. I was a hipster barista before it was cool(1994). I signed my young life away for that equipment.

Anyhoo.. after all that… After having been told numerous timesI had served the best cup of coffee they ever had.

I now drink tasters choice with fat free hazelnut creamer. 2 minutes, no cleanup, done.

By: Sharon Solesbee

Sharon Solesbee — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 18:01:00 +0000

I’ve used a blender to grind beans – it’s a bit more meticulous but it works to get the savory aroma.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 07 Jan 2012 17:56:00 +0000

As long as it is high on caffeine, taste is secondary (and can be corrected with liberal applications of sweetener). ;)