“In the end, both Android and Blackberry differentiate themselves between different products.” No Android does, Blackberry Doesn’t

“In
general, though I really like Android (getting off iOS and onto Android
as soon as I can), I’m still not sure if it’s secure, to the level that
the Blackberry OS’ are.” It’s Linux, you have to open up security vulnerabilities yourself if you want them otherwise it’s very safe.

“In the end, both Android and Blackberry differentiate themselves between different products.” No Android does, Blackberry Doesn’t

“In
general, though I really like Android (getting off iOS and onto Android
as soon as I can), I’m still not sure if it’s secure, to the level that
the Blackberry OS’ are.” It’s Linux, you have to open up security vulnerabilities yourself if you want them otherwise it’s very safe.

“In the end, both Android and Blackberry differentiate themselves between different products.” No Android does, Blackberry Doesn’t

“In
general, though I really like Android (getting off iOS and onto Android
as soon as I can), I’m still not sure if it’s secure, to the level that
the Blackberry OS’ are.” It’s Linux, you have to open up security vulnerabilities yourself if you want them otherwise it’s very safe.

“In the end, both Android and Blackberry differentiate themselves between different products.” No Android does, Blackberry Doesn’t

“In
general, though I really like Android (getting off iOS and onto Android
as soon as I can), I’m still not sure if it’s secure, to the level that
the Blackberry OS’ are.” It’s Linux, you have to open up security vulnerabilities yourself if you want them otherwise it’s very safe.

Amazon is more of an exception as they resources RIM doesn’t have, along with providing services that helps overcome the device limitations of the Kindle Fire and don’t rely on hardware profit model.  While many people are side loading apps and figuring out ways to install the regular market on the Kindle Fire, which is not something they are likely to be able to do with a Blackberry device and it’s more locked down security.  Things like locked boot loader are standard on a Blackberry for example.

While other companies trying to get a product without full market access have usually failed.  Even Honeycomb had a slow adoption because of the need to get the apps updated for it and that was without being picky and needing apps to be certified.  So it’s likely to be a stumbling block for RIM if they go that route.

“- There are four known heavyweights in mobile patents, microsoft,
motorola, rim, and nokia. Nokia is a no brainer why they aren’t
licensing. Motorola is in litigation and has already invalidated one of
MS’s patents, and I am assuming RIM is safe because of their warchest. I
doubt this would change if they changed to android. I read MS’s claims
from the B&N case and they could just as easily try to use those
patents against BBOS but there is a reason they don’t. For one, BB uses
Bing, and two, I would assume they would have a nasty countersuit coming
their way for windows phone.”

Possible but remember RIM is in a very weakened position and may not be able to afford a long drown out litigation.  While adopting Android means they have to play by other rules than they deal with now and not all of their patents will protect them when using system designs they did not originate.

“- The reason these android devices like the motorola pro have failed is
because they may look like blackberries but they are not blackberries.
If they had access to BES and BBM, encryption, and all the tools BB
provides to IT admins, that would be a different story.”

Yes, those were factors but that’s part of the point.  RIM markets to a particular type of user base and it’s mainly the lack of general consumer appeal that’s hurting them for market share but they are holding on because they still appeal to their core base. 

Adopting Android also means they’ll start to have to appeal to features that Android users favor and that’s not what they are use to and like those who tried to look like BB’s the reverse can be true for RIM if they try to make Android devices like present market players are doing.

“Like I said though, their investment at this point is too heavily
invested in QNX. If BB10 fails, RIM more than likely ceases to exist in
the hardware market. ”

I agree, and a lot hinges on what they manage to do over the next year.

- The app market….ya I see your point but it doesn’t really defeat the purpose. There is a big difference between developers submitting an app they have already made to a new market than developing a new app with different code. I think this aspect would work very well, amazon has managed to do alright with this model. Not sure what the inherent limits are? Are you referring to the use of Java? Blackberries are Java based as well.

“Suffice it to say that there are reasons why Audiophiles and musicians still shy away from Android.  While for voice calls it’s not much a of a issue, even basic quality is fine for most people.  Though BB’s tend to have more consistent phone call qualities and I’ve found speaker quality to be better on BB’s than Android phones.  

Some companies are trying to fix this with making deals with audio companies for better speakers but I often have to use headphones or external speakers with my Android phones that I didn’t have to use with my old BB.”
-From what I read in your last post, it sounds like you are identifying the sound quality issues as external speaker issues. RIM would still be very much in control of their hardware and could incorporate what they like in this regard.  

“Considering MS is making more money from patents that effect Android phones than their own WP’s I wouldn’t count on it… ”

- There are four known heavyweights in mobile patents, microsoft, motorola, rim, and nokia. Nokia is a no brainer why they aren’t licensing. Motorola is in litigation and has already invalidated one of MS’s patents, and I am assuming RIM is safe because of their warchest. I doubt this would change if they changed to android. I read MS’s claims from the B&N case and they could just as easily try to use those patents against BBOS but there is a reason they don’t. For one, BB uses Bing, and two, I would assume they would have a nasty countersuit coming their way for windows phone.

“This brings up the other issue that unlike Android phones BB’s aren’t getting into the extra large size category of 4″-5″ screen sizes.  Each design change would have it’s pluses and minuses.  The differences in the core customer base has to be considered as there have been Android phones that tried to copy the BB basic design but they always failed.

Though if Android phones do manage to make headway into the Enterprise market then RIM may have no choice but to radically change their designs, regardless of whether they stick with their own OS or adopt a heavily modified version of Android.

The market is changing over the next few years and it remains to be seen if RIM can even survive long enough to adapt and catch up to how fast the market is advancing now.”
- The reason these android devices like the motorola pro have failed is because they may look like blackberries but they are not blackberries. If they had access to BES and BBM, encryption, and all the tools BB provides to IT admins, that would be a different story.

I think by looking at it as “if they make headway” is backwards. I think RIM could be that headway but only for their products. They could provide options for the curated appstore specifically for business handsets. No games or funny business allowed. For consumer devices, they would just use the android market. The beauty of open source is that RIM can make it whatever they want. The only major downside to this is the fact that the heavy security modification would significantly delay updates and further fragment the platform. Which is why they could have a consumer and an enterprise build available that could be loaded in five minutes as a signed OS depending on the customer. The consumer build would be similar to stock android while the enterprise build would be locked down tight.

Like I said though, their investment at this point is too heavily invested in QNX. If BB10 fails, RIM more than likely ceases to exist in the hardware market.

- The app market can be solved by the creation of a curated app store in blackberry app world”

Kinda defeats the purpose of switching to Android though, as one of the reasons RIM is having problems is because they don’t have as robust a app market and too many changes to Android means they might as well stick with what they have.

Also wouldn’t change that Blackberries are business orientated phones that don’t have the same appeal to regular consumers who’d rather use their devices for fun than business.

There are also some inherent limits to the Android OS that may never be overcome because it was designed from the start to be a mobile OS.

“- I have never heard of voice quality issues, I know a lot of android
devices were actually pioneers in introducing HD Voice, like the nexus
s.”

Suffice it to say that there are reasons why Audiophiles and musicians still shy away from Android.  While for voice calls it’s not much a of a issue, even basic quality is fine for most people.  Though BB’s tend to have more consistent phone call qualities and I’ve found speaker quality to be better on BB’s than Android phones. 

Some companies are trying to fix this with making deals with audio companies for better speakers but I often have to use headphones or external speakers with my Android phones that I didn’t have to use with my old BB.

“- RIM has one of the most robust mobile patent portfolios on the market.
I am sure they would be ok against MS since a lot of what MS is suing
for are things that RIM already does. I am assuming there is a reason
they haven’t been a target for anyone but Kodak yet.”

Considering MS is making more money from patents that effect Android phones than their own WP’s I wouldn’t count on it…

“* The only major hurdle I can see is that BB users have very specific
requirements when it comes to battery life. Large, high res touchscreens
tend to eat battery much more than a traditional blackberry does. They
would have to have fairly robust batteries like the RAZR MAXX in order
to appease this crowd.”

This brings up the other issue that unlike Android phones BB’s aren’t getting into the extra large size category of 4″-5″ screen sizes.  Each design change would have it’s pluses and minuses.  The differences in the core customer base has to be considered as there have been Android phones that tried to copy the BB basic design but they always failed.

Though if Android phones do manage to make headway into the Enterprise market then RIM may have no choice but to radically change their designs, regardless of whether they stick with their own OS or adopt a heavily modified version of Android.

The market is changing over the next few years and it remains to be seen if RIM can even survive long enough to adapt and catch up to how fast the market is advancing now.

- The core OS can be manipulated by RIM into whatever they want security wise, provided they don’t break the application framework.

- The app market can be solved by the creation of a curated app store in blackberry app world

- I have never heard of voice quality issues, I know a lot of android devices were actually pioneers in introducing HD Voice, like the nexus s.

- RIM has one of the most robust mobile patent portfolios on the market. I am sure they would be ok against MS since a lot of what MS is suing for are things that RIM already does. I am assuming there is a reason they haven’t been a target for anyone but Kodak yet.

* The only major hurdle I can see is that BB users have very specific requirements when it comes to battery life. Large, high res touchscreens tend to eat battery much more than a traditional blackberry does. They would have to have fairly robust batteries like the RAZR MAXX in order to appease this crowd.

I used to have a Dell Axim X50V with WinMo 2003. When WinMo 5.0 came out, the X50V became “legacy” hardware with no official 5.0 update. Not long after, I went out, found a 5.0 build for the X50V and installed it.

So okay, we’re talking Android. Android is Linux. While you can buy a Linux PC (typically Ubuntu,) none of the manufacturers deliver updates. Ubuntu releases a new build and the community goes to work applying fixes for the various hardware applications.

I treat my phones the same way as I do my PCs. I grant myself superuser priveledges on both and install whatever software I want on both. The Android community is great at putting together stable ROMs quickly from the newest releases and frankly, they have a better reputation than the OEMs.

It’s your hardware, own it. Otherwise, rest easy knowing that you got the exact phone with the exact OS you paid for. If you think about it, nobody owes you an update.

That being said, I really wish OEMs would pull their heads out of their @$$3$ and stand by their products with some timely updates.

While Android also still has issue with things like audio quality.  There are things that Android does better but there are things Blackberry does get right as well.  Going with Android may seem like a good idea but it has problems of its own and would effect RIM’s default Enterprise market versus trying to get more of the regular consumer market. 

Besides, going Android means RIM doesn’t have as much control and like many other companies will probably have to start paying MS royalty fees for those patents they own. :P

Personally I think there’s room for all the players.  In my perfect world, I’d have a Bold for work, an iPhone for play, and something such as the Transformer Prime for a tablet.

To say Blackberries have never changed is to say the iPhone has never changed, because it’s been a big touchscreen since the beginning.  Which is disingeneous at best.  I went from a basic old bricklike BB to a Curve to a Bold, and each was very different from the device before it.  And even the newest Bolds are very different from the one I had….to say nothing of the different formats of Torch, and the Storm.  I’m not saying they were smoother devices than Android or iOS devices….but they *did* change over the years.  What have they had consistent?  A screen and a QWERTY keyboard.  Outside of that, yes, the rest has changed.

The iPhone interface sucks (I don’t have one), but at least you can count on when a major update is going to come out. And even if it’s a not so major update, you at least get the update.

I don’t own an iPhone either, because they ARE all the same, from the first one to the iPhone 4s. Between the two, I would say android is more progressive definately. I’m not nocking Android, I think it’s a great platform. But when you get down to it, all the phones are pretty much the same.

However, that’s not enough for RIM level of security requirements. Joey Peloquin, director of mobile security for FishNet Security, even said “In its current state, Android is not anywhere near enterprise ready.” So they couldn’t use Android even if they wanted to as security is their main selling point.

So RIM is going to have to fix its own broken house and get better apps and system designs.  There Torch series is actually pretty nice but the problem is they got nothing that stands out to the non-corporate consumer.  They’re still playing catch up on hardware specs and features to appeal to a wider range of consumers.

Now for my second point: If all Android phones were, in fact, the same (I know my new Nexus looks just like my original Droid,) wouldn’t that mean that there was PLENTY of room for differentiation? In fact, they could just port Android over to their existing handsets and be COMPLETELY different from current Android hardware.

Mr. Heins, you’ve made the right call. We in the Android community don’t want your company’s stigma giving Android a bad name. Android is about choice and Blackberries, for the most part, are more similar to their predecessors than iPhones are to theirs.

Now, in RIM’s defense, there is a lot less buyer’s remorse within their ecosystem. Their customers don’t cry because someone got a better handset 6 weeks later. Though we get to laugh because someone paid too much to buy the same phone they got 2 years prior. I guess it still counts as an upgrade if you change the model number, right?

/wall-o-text

In the end, both Android and Blackberry differentiate themselves between different products.

In general, though I really like Android (getting off iOS and onto Android as soon as I can), I’m still not sure if it’s secure, to the level that the Blackberry OS’ are.

And for a CEO to speak so ignorantly of his greatest competition – the ones currently carrying the torch and crown of majority owners of the smartphone marketshare itself nonetheless – is not a good indicator of Blackberry’s ability to return to relevance. 

They need to understand their competition, crossing your fingers won’t create relevance.

That’s all Blackberry needs.  At a time where their biggest criticism and greatest risk of completely going under are directly tied to their ability to compete in the modern smartphone paradigm, they don’t need a CEO making quotes that seem to convey they don’t even understand who they are competing against.

To say “all Android phones are the same” is tantamount to saying you don’t understand the reasons Android has grown from 5% to 42% marketshare in a swift 2 years. 
This is the competitor RIM should most know inside and out, should be familiar with all Android versions, should be familiar with the skins that Carriers add and features they add and take away, should be familiar with the breadth of hardware that is available across all carriers with regard to Android phones, and how that affects the user experience.  If you aren’t – and instead actually say things like “all Android phones are the same” – that doesn’t say good things about your ability to compete.  To compete, you need to understand your competition.  Particularly Android, who has solid control of the Smartphone paradigm currently, and is growing exactly as fast as RIM marketshare is declining.

What an ignorant thing to come from a CEO’s mouth.  This doesn’t paint a good picture for Blackberry’s future.

Boom!! RIM is back on top with the business users of the world.

I’m assuming you’ll complain next about how all iPhones are the same… We know what a crappy year they had!

Criticize android if you want, but only ignorance could doubt the variety of size, shape, and price of android devices.