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	<title>Comments on: Apple blocked from iPad name in China</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/</link>
	<description>Feeding Your Gadget and Tech Obsessions</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Kevin Holm</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161803</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Holm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Dec 2011 03:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161803</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[To end the confusion that most here on the discussion don&#039;t know. Apple purchased the iPad trademark from Proview in 2006 for ownership of the global trademark. The dispute now is whether the Chinese trademark was included in the package that Apple purchased. 

I guess my question to China would be. Why wouldn&#039;t it of been. Apple purchased the trademark for ownership of the global trademark and that would include everywhere. Why would they exclude a country that ultimately would be a customer. And I&#039;m sure Proview made a lot of money in 2006.

So to those who blast Apple for not getting a trademark. Try doing some research first. Looks to me like they did.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To end the confusion that most here on the discussion don&#8217;t know. Apple purchased the iPad trademark from Proview in 2006 for ownership of the global trademark. The dispute now is whether the Chinese trademark was included in the package that Apple purchased. </p>
<p>I guess my question to China would be. Why wouldn&#8217;t it of been. Apple purchased the trademark for ownership of the global trademark and that would include everywhere. Why would they exclude a country that ultimately would be a customer. And I&#8217;m sure Proview made a lot of money in 2006.</p>
<p>So to those who blast Apple for not getting a trademark. Try doing some research first. Looks to me like they did.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161769</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Dec 2011 03:03:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161769</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Chinese companies AND Korean companies, as well as Taiwanese companies to a lesser extent, completely ignore copyrights and patents - their own courts will ALWAYS side with companies based in their countries - while courts all over the world and particularly in the United States generally ignore their thefts.  The only time an American court will uphold a patent or copyright is when two American owned entities are involved in the dispute.  This is a major international issue which American law and American courts must address NOW because continuing to ignore reality means the U.S. will be a third world country 10 years from now.  This is NOT a game.  What we&#039;re ignoring is economic war against American companies and the only way to counteract it is to adopt the Chinese and Korean tactics of looting and raping their competition.  

And I say this as an individual regularly derided as a &#039;librul commie/nazi socialist&#039; by America&#039;s &#039;permanent majority&#039; morons.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chinese companies AND Korean companies, as well as Taiwanese companies to a lesser extent, completely ignore copyrights and patents &#8211; their own courts will ALWAYS side with companies based in their countries &#8211; while courts all over the world and particularly in the United States generally ignore their thefts.  The only time an American court will uphold a patent or copyright is when two American owned entities are involved in the dispute.  This is a major international issue which American law and American courts must address NOW because continuing to ignore reality means the U.S. will be a third world country 10 years from now.  This is NOT a game.  What we&#8217;re ignoring is economic war against American companies and the only way to counteract it is to adopt the Chinese and Korean tactics of looting and raping their competition.  </p>
<p>And I say this as an individual regularly derided as a &#8216;librul commie/nazi socialist&#8217; by America&#8217;s &#8216;permanent majority&#8217; morons.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161766</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Dec 2011 02:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161766</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[So you want to eliminate the American economy as a factor in the world, right?  Hence, the cheerleading for that.  Instead of the end of the road for Apple, the end of the road for you would be far more entertaining.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So you want to eliminate the American economy as a factor in the world, right?  Hence, the cheerleading for that.  Instead of the end of the road for Apple, the end of the road for you would be far more entertaining.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Hbk_chrismatic</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161587</link>
		<dc:creator>Hbk_chrismatic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2011 13:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161587</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nobody knew linksys iPhone but everyone knows apple iPhone dude thats beauty of apple.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nobody knew linksys iPhone but everyone knows apple iPhone dude thats beauty of apple.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Hbk_chrismatic</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161585</link>
		<dc:creator>Hbk_chrismatic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2011 13:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161585</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Haters always thought that but it never happened and I am not seeing that happening in near future. PPl forget using ugly win mobile and symbian devices until apple showed the world how a smart phone should look like. Ppl thought tablet idea was stupid and now every company is making them?  Apple&#039;s beauty is they use existing technologies and draw beautiful things out of them ...end of road? ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Haters always thought that but it never happened and I am not seeing that happening in near future. PPl forget using ugly win mobile and symbian devices until apple showed the world how a smart phone should look like. Ppl thought tablet idea was stupid and now every company is making them?  Apple&#8217;s beauty is they use existing technologies and draw beautiful things out of them &#8230;end of road? </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Washington</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161561</link>
		<dc:creator>Washington</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2011 07:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161561</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[BEGINNING OF THE END OF THE ROAD FOR APPLE.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BEGINNING OF THE END OF THE ROAD FOR APPLE.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: SoCal</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161347</link>
		<dc:creator>SoCal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 22:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161347</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Apple should just license the name and pay the money. They&#039;ll make that money back within the first few months anyways.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apple should just license the name and pay the money. They&#8217;ll make that money back within the first few months anyways.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jon Garrett</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161339</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Garrett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 22:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161339</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[it wasn&#039;t Linksys either it was Infogear which was then purchased by Cisco. I was going off memory. people like you who didnt know this are the ones who need to use Google. 

the point is, I&#039;m aware of this you never knew this til I brought it up.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it wasn&#8217;t Linksys either it was Infogear which was then purchased by Cisco. I was going off memory. people like you who didnt know this are the ones who need to use Google. </p>
<p>the point is, I&#8217;m aware of this you never knew this til I brought it up.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: koller</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161330</link>
		<dc:creator>koller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 21:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161330</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[it was linksys not netgear!!! google it &quot;linksys iPhone&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>it was linksys not netgear!!! google it &#8220;linksys iPhone&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: plunder</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161316</link>
		<dc:creator>plunder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 21:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161316</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for the info.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the info.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jon Garrett</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161255</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Garrett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 17:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161255</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[what does that have to do with anything, the name belongs to somebody else. period. if apple can sue someone and win just because they made a thin tablet then someone should be able to sue apple for using a name that doesn&#039;t belong to apple.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>what does that have to do with anything, the name belongs to somebody else. period. if apple can sue someone and win just because they made a thin tablet then someone should be able to sue apple for using a name that doesn&#8217;t belong to apple.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jon Garrett</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161254</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Garrett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 17:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161254</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[dude, they did the same thing with the iPhone.  Netgear made and was selling an iPhone since about 1995 then along comes apple in 2005 to try to take the name from them. ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dude, they did the same thing with the iPhone.  Netgear made and was selling an iPhone since about 1995 then along comes apple in 2005 to try to take the name from them. </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: AppleFUD</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161228</link>
		<dc:creator>AppleFUD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 15:35:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161228</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[yep. . . especially considering they take many of the names for their products before asking the company with the trademark--apple figures they can do whatever they want whenever they want. About time someone said NO!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yep. . . especially considering they take many of the names for their products before asking the company with the trademark&#8211;apple figures they can do whatever they want whenever they want. About time someone said NO!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: AppleFUD</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161226</link>
		<dc:creator>AppleFUD</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 15:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161226</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If it&#039;s fair for apple to go after companies for making a thin rectangular device with rounded corners then this is more than fair.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If it&#8217;s fair for apple to go after companies for making a thin rectangular device with rounded corners then this is more than fair.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: William Johnson</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161217</link>
		<dc:creator>William Johnson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 15:22:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161217</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[First off this is just dumb... If this makes your day better than you more than likely need to get a life! Second does anyone really think that Apple will change the name of the iPad??? Answer is no..... Yes they got sued but I highly doubt China will say &quot;You can&#039;t sell iPad&#039;s here cause of the name...&quot; Third these things happen in the tech world about every 5 seconds... This is nothing new to Apple]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First off this is just dumb&#8230; If this makes your day better than you more than likely need to get a life! Second does anyone really think that Apple will change the name of the iPad??? Answer is no&#8230;.. Yes they got sued but I highly doubt China will say &#8220;You can&#8217;t sell iPad&#8217;s here cause of the name&#8230;&#8221; Third these things happen in the tech world about every 5 seconds&#8230; This is nothing new to Apple</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161200</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 14:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161200</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[now apple can just open their own fake iPad store in China.  There&#039;s enough already, no one will notice.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>now apple can just open their own fake iPad store in China.  There&#8217;s enough already, no one will notice.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Annon15</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161176</link>
		<dc:creator>Annon15</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 13:04:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161176</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[But surely, if you looked at the two products side by side from 3 meters away, even a highly trained lawyer wouldnt be able to distinguish one from the other?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But surely, if you looked at the two products side by side from 3 meters away, even a highly trained lawyer wouldnt be able to distinguish one from the other?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Lon Grove</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161165</link>
		<dc:creator>Lon Grove</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 12:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161165</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks SlashGear. It&#039;s good to start the day with a smile on your face and this story certainly did that.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks SlashGear. It&#8217;s good to start the day with a smile on your face and this story certainly did that.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: timbox100</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161160</link>
		<dc:creator>timbox100</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 12:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161160</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[While I like to see apple getting a blooded nose once in a while. I kind of see it like the pot calling the Kettle black. With China companies ignoring court orders, not paying fines and just basically doing what the hell it likes. Thinking of the Dyson cases recently.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I like to see apple getting a blooded nose once in a while. I kind of see it like the pot calling the Kettle black. With China companies ignoring court orders, not paying fines and just basically doing what the hell it likes. Thinking of the Dyson cases recently.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: plunder</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161161</link>
		<dc:creator>plunder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 12:07:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161161</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What&#039;s in a name? But Apple sell iPods, iPhones and so on; the name fitted their range well and they probably want to keep it. It is a bit of a surprise that Apple did not research the iPad name before launching it; and make a deal then. Now Proview will want a LOT more for for that trademark. 

One has to smile really, Apple have a tenancy to tie other companies in legal knots over comparatively vague issues; now they have a serious headache with the name of a major product. In fact could Proview extend their claim beyond China and ruin Apples whole month?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What&#8217;s in a name? But Apple sell iPods, iPhones and so on; the name fitted their range well and they probably want to keep it. It is a bit of a surprise that Apple did not research the iPad name before launching it; and make a deal then. Now Proview will want a LOT more for for that trademark. </p>
<p>One has to smile really, Apple have a tenancy to tie other companies in legal knots over comparatively vague issues; now they have a serious headache with the name of a major product. In fact could Proview extend their claim beyond China and ruin Apples whole month?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Counsel Dew</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161157</link>
		<dc:creator>Counsel Dew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 11:58:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161157</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[... Simply amazing.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230; Simply amazing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Keith Thomas</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161155</link>
		<dc:creator>Keith Thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 11:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161155</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[really after all the garbage Apple pulls in courts, people go and get their feelings hurt over this? Apple deserves it, this is the kind of stuff they do to other companies. ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>really after all the garbage Apple pulls in courts, people go and get their feelings hurt over this? Apple deserves it, this is the kind of stuff they do to other companies. </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Marcus</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161152</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 11:46:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161152</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Except that their &quot;IPad&quot; is NOT a handheld computer. There is no confusion between the Apple IPad and the Proview&#039;s IP Application Development (IPAD). This reeks of Chinese corruption. Unfortunately apple has a lot of factories in China so they cant afford to just leave and not pay.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Except that their &#8220;IPad&#8221; is NOT a handheld computer. There is no confusion between the Apple IPad and the Proview&#8217;s IP Application Development (IPAD). This reeks of Chinese corruption. Unfortunately apple has a lot of factories in China so they cant afford to just leave and not pay.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Thecoyote23</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161149</link>
		<dc:creator>Thecoyote23</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 11:33:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161149</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[They probably just backdated/forged paperwork to extort money from a US company. China has been working on a form of economic warfare for years against the US.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They probably just backdated/forged paperwork to extort money from a US company. China has been working on a form of economic warfare for years against the US.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161147</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 11:32:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161147</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sorry they had the name way before Apple did. Proview are just defending there Trademark.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry they had the name way before Apple did. Proview are just defending there Trademark.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: n900mixalot</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161144</link>
		<dc:creator>n900mixalot</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 11:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161144</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This from China... Since when have they cracked down on anything bootleg? This is just an extortive means to a shady end.

That&#039;s one country I&#039;ll never set foot in. Rather go to Iran.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This from China&#8230; Since when have they cracked down on anything bootleg? This is just an extortive means to a shady end.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s one country I&#8217;ll never set foot in. Rather go to Iran.</p>
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		<title>By: Salmander</title>
		<link>http://www.slashgear.com/apple-blocked-from-ipad-name-in-china-07200589/#comment-161139</link>
		<dc:creator>Salmander</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Dec 2011 10:56:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.slashgear.com/?p=200589#comment-161139</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[there are days when i wish the world&#039;s ultimate greatest salesman was still around... wonder wat his reaction would&#039;ve been... &#039;his&#039; mighty apple beaten at its/his own game... incredible....!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>there are days when i wish the world&#8217;s ultimate greatest salesman was still around&#8230; wonder wat his reaction would&#8217;ve been&#8230; &#8216;his&#8217; mighty apple beaten at its/his own game&#8230; incredible&#8230;.!</p>
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